The evolution of the Red Ajah

[Siera]

Again nothing constructive from me but i am a huge fan of this idea.

But I do also agree with Carra in that we can have these ideas try it out with a Major RP with the Reds and maybe a few others to make SURE IC it works before we set it into stone OOC (so that we suddenly don't have 4 characters with no Ajah if it doesn't work).

I hope this doesn't come across as me saying no to further discussion, I'm totally fine with it I just think before we finalize anything we should try it IC.

[Sunny]

I think that it needs to be formalized OOC and then gradually worked towards IC, personally.

Because this change is kind of big, I actually think it needs to be summarized and put in the (OOC) Hall to vote the change in- I doubt anyone who isn't in this thread would actually vote against it, but that's what the Hall is for, and it needs to be utilized.

As we're doing that and the site is updated, we can plot and plan on how to make it work for each character individually in character.

If it turns out it doesn't work so well on a broad scale, then we come back and adjust again. It's not a big deal.

[Waymon]

Greys do try to prevent the conflict before it begins however it’s almost shallow to assume that they wouldn’t realize the conflict is coming. I interpret the currently suggested ideas as Reds are the opposite site of the coin of the Greys. As Casten currently is in all likelihood going Grey he is more of the camp of ‘If you want peace, prepare for war’. Fighting it out isn’t the best option however in a fight let’s make sure to have the biggest stick.

I look at it like the Greys and Reds could work more closely together in this regard for the Conceptualization #1. The Right hand sues for peace before the left hand neutralizes the threat.

#2 This makes perfect sense. It gets rid of the troubling vagueness the previous description of the Ajah and as others mentioned that it keeps closer to the canon feel of the Ajah. I personally would like to see, if this was executed as well, is if we got them to focus on the Forsaken almost exclusively followed by enemy channelers (whether it’s people from Shara, WT, BT, or the Seanchan) as learning how to combat the Forsaken via channeling would also work in regards to defending against other channelers. Worrying about Dreadlords and the such would be more in the Green’s portfolio.

#3 I can take or leave this one. As Jenny stated all Ajahs gather information. This could be streamlined into focusing on finding a particular Forsaken or Shara for example. Even the WT and BT.

[Carra]

I don't think that is neccessary. What is Ajah business should be Ajah business. It impacts us the most, it doesn't change the fundamental core of what GT is or change any rules for it really need that kind of vote.

[Sunny]

Any member of this site could potentially be interested in joining the Red Ajah, and therefore it certainly effects everyone. A Hall vote is important to maintain the spirit of this community, and I am going to insist that it happen, even if it is only a formality, for that reason.

[Sunny]

Greys do try to prevent the conflict before it begins however it’s almost shallow to assume that they wouldn’t realize the conflict is coming. I interpret the currently suggested ideas as Reds are the opposite site of the coin of the Greys. As Casten currently is in all likelihood going Grey he is more of the camp of ‘If you want peace, prepare for war’. Fighting it out isn’t the best option however in a fight let’s make sure to have the biggest stick.

I look at it like the Greys and Reds could work more closely together in this regard for the Conceptualization #1. The Right hand sues for peace before the left hand neutralizes the threat.

#2 This makes perfect sense. It gets rid of the troubling vagueness the previous description of the Ajah and as others mentioned that it keeps closer to the canon feel of the Ajah. I personally would like to see, if this was executed as well, is if we got them to focus on the Forsaken almost exclusively followed by enemy channelers (whether it’s people from Shara, WT, BT, or the Seanchan) as learning how to combat the Forsaken via channeling would also work in regards to defending against other channelers. Worrying about Dreadlords and the such would be more in the Green’s portfolio.

#3 I can take or leave this one. As Jenny stated all Ajahs gather information. This could be streamlined into focusing on finding a particular Forsaken or Shara for example. Even the WT and BT.

All of this makes good sense. <3

With #3 my thought was that rather than having Eyes and Ears, the Reds would be their own Eyes and Ears. But I agree that 1 and 2 are more than enough without making #3 an Ajah-wide feature.

[Trent]

I've also always seen the Grey's approach as being very diplomatic and official: Envoys, diplomats, ambassadors, negotiators and the like. Whereas the Red isn't necessarily interested in ending conflict between us and enemy channelers in a broad sense so much as specialists to literally protect GT and our interests from channeling threats. Like the difference between the hostage negotiator and the SWAT team in a hostage situation. Both are tools to end the conflict, but they have very different roles.

[Sunny]

If / when this becomes official, I'm making myself a SWAT sig.

<_<;

[Sunny]

I want to take a second to acknowledge something. When I see a problem, I want to fix it. I am bad at acknowledging the preceding work that already went into the situation; all I see is the problem. It falls into that "black and white thinking" thing I mentioned in my first post.

The truth is that Carra put a lot of work into the Red Ajah. I completely understand her attachment to it, and that it is sad to see her figurative baby being tossed around. Without her effort, this entire "branch" of RP possibility wouldn't exist, this conversation would not be happening....an entirely new dynamic (regardless of details) would not exist. Her work deserves to be appreciated and loved, and I think that because of my "problem solving" demeanor, I accidentally completely wiped out the empathy that would have made the conversation easier for her to participate in.

I do not (and did not) want to completely over write her ideas, but I think that that may have been lost right from the get go. When I made the thread I couldn't see any other way to do it, so that is what I suggested. However, thanks to input from many others a solidly workable solution that expands on, rather than completely replacing, her original concept came out of the woodwork. That makes me super-duper happy because Carra puts her whole heart into everything and deserves to see the things she makes grow.

Yes, I am insisting on a Hall vote. I'm doing so because I love the GT, and no other reason. One of the things that made this site so different for so long was the fact that our membership had active say in what happened, no matter how large or small, via the Hall. I broke that tradition when I became Amyrlin two years ago, but when I did so, I promised that we would go back to that model when we were big enough to warrant it...and we have more active membership now than we have in over a decade. It's time to shift back to that model, one issue at a time.

[Carra]

I understand why you are insisting on a Hall vote, but at this time I honestly believe it is unnecessary, and I must insist that you step back and let all members of Red weigh in, and let us work together before even fielding anything to the Hall. At least one hasn't at all, and I feel overrun with "all the things" and I really would like -as the originator and Head- to evaluate the information given and write up something tangible for Reds to try and use before ANYTHING goes to the Hall for a finalized vote. Period. While this is our Ajah, it really does stem form me and I don't like being pushed around. I do mean that with respect, and I understand where you are coming from. I simply do not agree.

I want to take time this weekend -hopefully- to consolidate. Talk to the three other Reds individually on what they want, what they see for their character, and how they would approach new Reds with these idea's and build a tangible concept for the Reds. Right now I am attempting to relax and I need a clear, unbiased mind to do this with any form of honesty.